Podcast

In this episode of Curriculum Conversations, host Jo Kukuczka explores Education for Sustainable Development (ESD) in higher education with Tom Ritchie. Moving beyond traditional environmental approaches, Tom reveals how he has used ESD to transform curriculum design in chemistry through interdisciplinary thinking, systems approaches, and human-centered pedagogy. Tom shares practical examples from his innovative "Beyond Science" module, where first-year chemistry students tackle real sustainability challenges on campus while developing critical thinking, digital literacy, and belonging. From AI ethics podcasts to cross-disciplinary mentoring, Jo and Tom discuss how to embed sustainability throughout the curriculum rather than treating it as an add-on. Their conversation unpacks the key principles of ESD – interdisciplinarity, systems thinking, futures thinking, values orientation, and digital literacy – and demonstrates how they both create future-ready graduates equipped to address the wicked problems of the 21st century. Whether you are designing a single module or reviewing an entire programme, this episode offers actionable insights for making your curriculum more sustainable, inclusive, and transformational.

This podcast is useful for educators looking to move beyond surface-level sustainability integration toward meaningful curriculum transformation that prepares students as both disciplinary experts and global citizens.

• Advance HE ESD ToolkitLink opens in a new window - Referenced as Tom's go-to resource for ESD principles

• AI Ethics NowLink opens in a new window - Tom's podcast exploring ethical considerations in AI, mentioned as part of his interdisciplinary AI module

• Education for SustainabilityLink opens in a new window Padlet – related resources collated by Jo

• Lozano, R. et al. (2013). Declarations for sustainability in higher education: becoming better leaders, through addressing the university system. Journal of Cleaner Production, 48, 10-19

• Sterling, S. (2001). Sustainable Education: Re-visioning Learning and Change. Green Books

• UNESCO Education for Sustainable DevelopmentLink opens in a new window - For the official ESD definition and framework

• UN Sustainable Development GoalsLink opens in a new window - Essential context for understanding the SDG framework used in curriculum design

• Wals, A. E. J. (2014). Sustainability in higher education in the context of the UN DESD: A review of learning and institutionalisation processes. Journal of Cleaner Production, 62, 8-15

00:01

Hello and welcome to the Curriculum Conversations podcast. My name is Jo Kukuczka and I'm delighted that you have joined us today. Enjoy. In today's episode, we are talking about education for sustainable development in curriculum, in curriculum design specifically with our guest, Dr. Tom Ritchie. Hello, Tom. Thank you for coming. Hi, Jo. How you doing? Can you tell us how did you come to this conversation?

00:24

Yeah. So I am a reader and director of student experience in the chemistry department here at Warwick. I also am the education for sustainable development academic lead. So I lead the ESD action group. A lot of my interest, suppose, in ESD and in curriculum design comes from the module that I did with you, the PGA curriculum development. I completed that last year and it really helped me understand, I think, my practice and how I can build sustainability into the curriculum.

00:51

What does it mean, education for sustainable development? What is it? So let's start with the definition. So UNESCO defines ESD as education that enables every human being to acquire the knowledge, skills and attitudes necessary to shape a sustainable future. And I think for me, the way that I see it in curriculum design particularly is about going beyond just the environmental aspects of sustainability. So often when I speak to colleagues and we talk about ESD and sustainability, everyone just goes to the environmental thing. Everyone just thinks, oh, it's recycling or it's...

01:21

water harvesting or something, you know, all of which are really important and are things that we need to be doing. But actually, for me, ESD is something much more that begins to empower the students I teach with the knowledge, the skills and the attitudes that they need to be able to address the wicked challenges that we see on campus and in the world, like climate change and inequality, where in my context, just being a chemist isn't enough to solve that. You have to think beyond just that skill set. I think in the context of

01:50

curriculum design, I also spend a lot of time trying to think about the ways that ESD can be used to address the sustainability of the learning environment themselves. we have to create inclusive learning environments where students feel like they belong. So I do a lot of work on belonging at the university. And I think that's a fundamental part of sustainable education. If students feel like they belong in the classroom and they can engage.

02:13

with the topics that they're learning, with the critical thinking and the other things, they can develop the resilience and the skill set they need to become those sustainability leaders. So I've kind of take a slightly different approach to it perhaps than other people do. Wonderful. Thank you. I think it really links to this thinking, okay, what is the purpose of higher education almost, right? It is to learn for the students, right? But is there...

02:38

something more and you've already mentioned those different contexts, right, environmental changes, know, social issues, and this is where ESD comes in, right? And I think if we think about education, if we think about what would a truly sustainable approach look like, it would be, it would link to, and again, we've done some work in chemistry on this around the We Are Chemistry project and how we build our curriculum and the student experience, but a truly sustainable approach, I think, would recognise those different connections between

03:07

obviously the academic context, also student wellbeing, the pastoral context, the belonging and studentscapacity to engage with the broader sustainability challenges through curriculum design. So we use a lot of human-centred approaches. So we want to focus on the student in the classroom. And I think that approach to curriculum design where you're not just lecturing a student, you'reactually giving them opportunities to engage with activities and ideas and working groups.

03:33

aligns much more with the kind of leave no one behind theme that sits within all of the sustainable development goals, which are a key part of education for sustainable development. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. So I think you've already said quite a lot about belonging and belonging and mattering or belonging or mattering how big the role of this is in general. So that kind of brings me to our second question, which is more about perhaps the principles.

04:02

almost thetheory behind ESD. So if you were to say, what are the key principles of ESD in relation to curriculum design and higher education specifically? What could those be? I mean, I think a really good place to start would be look at the Advanced HE toolkit that they have around ESD principles. I think that's where I spend a lot of my time reading, but there are some for me that I think would be crucial. So interdisciplinarity would be the first one. So the ability to break down different silos between subjects.

04:31

I mentioned earlier on, it's for my students, most of what I do is try to convince them that you need to go beyond just chemistry to deal with these wicked problems. A bit more about myself. So I work in chemistry, but I'm not from chemistry. I'm from history and I don't teach chemistry or history in my role. I tend to teach other things like innovation, design thinking. And so I have been lucky enough to see the different disciplines and how you can link this element of history with this element of chemistry, this element of design thinking. And that's

05:00

Interdisciplinarity, think, has been crucial for me to understand more about why this is important. But that'sa really important skill set, I think, for students to be able to learn. I teach an AI module with iAtul, and we approach the topic of AI from as many different disciplinary lenses as possible. We don't just look at it as how do you train an algorithm. We try to go at it from the point of view of, well, look at it from the point of view of dystopias. So we look at English literature, we look at

05:29

AI through the lens of technology panics, so much more of the history lens. look at it at future casting of actually howcan we begin to speculate on what that future looks like. And by getting students from all different disciplines to bring their subject knowledge, but then think of this topic in this more complex way, you start to see how they can understand the challenges that come with particularly AI in this context. But that's something for me that I appreciate you can't do that in every single module.

05:58

If you're teaching organic chemistry, you probably aren't going to be bringing much history into it, but there are ways of bringing those themes in, perhaps more to do with the assessment types that you use that we can talk about a bit later on as a way to bring that interdisciplinarity into the student experience. I think another one would be systems thinking. So again, trying to get students to understand the interconnections between things and how the world is a system and that we can affect different parts of the system with our actions. I think that's an important one.

06:27

I've mentioned future casting, but this idea of getting students to consider into the future and actually develop their capabilities to, we call it future casting, we call it threat casting as well, and actually recognizing what could be coming that's a threat and how do we work to either work towards something or work away from it and getting people to consider longer term impacts than just I'm a chemist in the year that I'm in. Another one for me, think, would be values orientation around

06:57

education for sustainable development. So getting students to think about ethics and justice and kind of equity when you're learning. So again, that can be challenging in your, again, I'm going to pick organic chemistry, but if I think about the experience my students have while they do their organic chemistry module where this is much harder to bring in, they also have the opportunity to do other modules. So innovation 101 that I teach that talks about kind of ethics of AI, talks about ethics of

07:25

of design thinking and different business practices. And the module itself is all about working with people. The AI module that we offer as well is trying to get people to think about their values in relation to the topic. they're not just learning to then go and sit an exam. They're learning to be more critical about the subject and themselves as part of that. think another key principle, and I realize I've got a lot, so apologies, but another key principle I think would be, and I've mentioned AI, but particularly with the increasing...

07:53

popularity and use of AI in higher education. Digital literacy is a really key one. And I think whether you're doing an AI module or not, AI is becoming a bigger part of not just how we're going to have to design curriculum. We're going to have to design them, not necessarily to be AI proof, but to actually integrate AI as part of that. And I think we need students to understand, and we actually need staff to understand as well, the different capabilities of AI, the limitations, the ethical implications and

08:22

How do we ensure that we call it human in the loop? How do we ensure the human part is still in there? And we're not just, you know, you and I could sit down very easily, create a curriculum using AI. We could then create assessments using AI, assessment materials using AI, and we could probably market using AI. So how do we ensure that we don't do that? How do we ensure that the human stays in the loop and that we are teaching students where they add their value? So yeah, absolutely, you can use AI for this topic or this activity, but you don't just use it to create your...

08:52

final assessment or just to help you, you know, write your piece of coursework. But that's a really challenging area, I think, particularly around AI at the moment, because it'sreally unclear. It'sreally unclear what the what the limitations are for using it within higher education. And I think we if I look at the American context where I've been doing a bit of work, they seem to much further ahead with this in terms of how are they integrating AI, how are they

09:18

making a really conscious effort. Whereas I think in higher education in the UK, we're slightly waiting, but I don't know what we're waiting for at the moment. But we're waiting for something before we, I think, make a move in how we think about that human AI collaboration more. Right. So if I just summarise, and I'm not sure I remembered well, so the key principles use that interdisciplinarity, I think. Systems thinking.

09:44

Digital literacy, futures thinking as well. Digital literacy. you told us quite a lot about, you know, how AI comes into the picture here. And if I just point our listeners as well to your podcast, will be the details will be in the description, but you've got, you've got an entire podcast on AI specifically and those different ethical considerations and other things, right? To kind of bring us up to speed. And then one more thing you said, one other principle, which I

10:13

forgot. So interdisciplinarity, systems thinking, digital literacy. there was a fourth one. There was futures thinking and values. Oh values. Yeah. Lovely. Thank you. now translating it into practice. you were to tell us, okay, so what could ESD in curriculum design look like in practice? what could an assessment item look like or maybe a learning activity? Would you share some examples? So for me, I think

10:41

You mentioned the podcast, so that is called AI Ethics Now, and it's part of the AI module that I mentioned. And if I think about what can ESD look like in curriculum design, I'll pick on just learning activities, I think, in this first instance. And so I teach a module to my first year students called Beyond Science, andit's all chemistry students, and they have to come in and choose a group research project that they can work on. Very similar to lots of group research project modules that students will have done.

11:09

The differences and how we've tried to bring ESD principles into that. The first week is we talk about the sustainable development goals, we put them in a local context, so we try to look at them in Coventry and on campus, and then we encourage students to select their top three. We then put them in a group based on that. And then once they've selected those, we put them in a group and they have to work on their sustainable development goals for the rest of the module. The intent being that we try to get them to work on their problem

11:39

in the context of campus. So they treat campus as a living lab in that way. So one that I can think of are students who worked this year on water harvesting in their accommodation on campus and actually looking at, and I learned something at the poster presentations the other day that half of campus sits within one boundary for the water that's supplied and another sits in the other boundary for Coventry and Warwickshire. And they were looking at the different ways in which water can be harvested through these places and spaces.

12:06

And the module is designed that the students have to think about these challenges, actively think about sustainable development goals, think about them in the context of campus, which they can then translate outside. But then they also have to each week intentionally reflect on their work as a team to make sure that they're bringing all their skill sets in. So we teach them about different things. So it can range from public speaking, which they need for their final poster presentations, to poster design, to workingwith external stakeholders. And so we...

12:36

intentionally designed the module so that they have to go out and speak to someone outside of the module. In the context of the water harvesting team, they go and speak to the sustainability team on campus and have these discussions, which as a first year is a real challenge to go and meet these people, but it's to give them the space to test their capabilities. If I think about interdisciplinarity, going back to the principles, we also put mentors with each group who are PhD students or early career fellows.

13:02

but not from chemistry. So you have, say, a French study student sitting with this group of chemists, talking to them and helping them interrogate their own understandings of a problem. In terms of systems thinking, I've mentioned we get them to think about theirspecific sustainable development goal in the context of campus and how that fits within that system. In terms of futures thinking, just to relate it back to those principles again, we challenge the students to think about, so

13:26

that module lasts for the entirety of their first year and they have toplan ahead in terms of their project launch. They have to be kind of continuously reflecting on their progress each week and then their final poster is half of their problem and then half of their research and reflection as a group and actually how have we worked together? How have we worked properly as a team? How have we incorporated different perspectives? And then for the values orientation part of it as well, we encourage the students to reflect on

13:55

the challenges that come with their SDG then beyond campus as well. it's whilstthey'll focus on their on-campus problem, we get them to think beyond that at the same time. If I think about howI've bought ESD to that and to other modules as well, the approach I would take, I would say is to take an integrated approach. So trying to weave sustainability throughout the entire curriculum rather than just having it in week one when we talk about SDGs and then just kind of bumbling through the next 15 weeks and then...

14:23

having at the end with the poster design. So practically howwe've done that, I mentioned about the mentors. Soyou've instantly got people from different disciplines trying to challenge students to think about sustainability from different perspectives. But in terms of integrating it, we intentionally create space in the lectures each week to be able to invite different groups from campus to come and speak about what it is that they work on. So recognising that students are very time poor and can't always see the opportunities that are available to them.

14:54

We give 15 minutes, as I say, each week. So one week we will have someone from Careers come in and talk about careers support that students can get. We then have someone come in from the sustainability team to talk about things that happening on campus. We then have someone come in from the Undergraduate Research Support Scheme, or URSS, to talk about, OK, so you've done this small group research project that's very supported. And to use a bowling metaphor, has the barriers up. But actually, now you can take this further and do your own research project in the summer.

15:22

That's how we try to integrate it throughout each part of the module as well. So recognising that students are more than just the hour that they spend in the classroom or that students learn in different ways and have different preferences, we always record podcasts that go along with the content. So not only do we get them to reflect on the content that I'll speak about in the lecture, we also have a podcast with someone external. So if we're talking about public speaking, is always the example I use. We...

15:48

have a podcast with someone who works in the European Union and talks about it in their context, but links it to issues of sustainability for policies that they've worked on. And we do the same for each week of the content. So it doesn't matter if we're talking about poster design. In the week that we do that, we speak to a former alumni of Warwick who works for a green pharmacology company. And it's just ways of bringing in, I think for us, sustainability in as many different ways as we can, both in the content, but also the way that we approach teaching for the students.

16:17

If they miss the lecture, for example, it is recorded, they can access it, but I want them to go beyond just listening to me. I want them to be critical about what they're learning, to listen to this podcast and then reflect on it with their group in their learning circle and say, do you know what? I disagreed with what this person said. I think that public speaking is much more about this rather than that. And they do that over 15 weeks. And the point is that by the end of the module, they have not only...

16:42

done a sustainability project. They've learned skills that will lend themselves to sustainability challenges like critical thinking, communication, andit's trying to just integrate all of that in. So that's beyond science. Another thing very quickly that I'll say that I do that is, I think, my approach to try to make my curriculum design kind of more sustainable is I undertook an apprenticeship to become a professional coach so that I can offer my students like instantaneous one-on-one sessions that they can book in with me.

17:11

to talk about the content, to talk about sustainability questions and to help them build their kind of professional identity and link that to sustainability as well. And the point of that is not everyone should do that. It's a lot of work, but it is a really interesting and slightly different way of supporting students beyond just saying, I have an office hour on a Thursday. It's you can book time in with me when you need and students take advantage of that. As an educator, that is a really good way of...

17:39

engaging with how like almost having a finger on the pulse, I suppose, of how students are doing. Because I know that if I get 20 requests for this assignment, then I need to go and look at the assignment brief because clearlyI've done something wrong there. So again, it's, I hesitate to use the word ecosystem, but it's trying to build that ecosystem around your module. Soyou're not just transactionally going in teaching your lecture and leaving. For me, it's much more about how can you make it that students are, as I say, learning from the content, but also learning skills asthey're going as well.

18:09

And I think they also probably learn about themselves, right, as global citizens, as well as, you know, becoming chemistry professionals and so on, right, in that same time. And then I wonder also how they learn to embrace discomfort, perhaps, because those social issues, environmental issues, that's not something very comfortable to potentially learn about, talk about, right? I think it's a really good point. And for a lot of our students, they see themselves, if I reflect on that,

18:39

when they get to year three, they see themselves very much as chemists first. They don't see themselves as creative. They don't particularly see themselves as global citizens, which is why we took to this course and we designed it with students. basically sat down with third years and said, if you could go back to your first year, what would you like to see? And we spoke to secondary school teachers and college teachers as well and said, where, how do we bridge where, where your students are when they leave you to where we need them to be in year one, year two. And so this module.

19:07

beyond science particularly is built as a bridge to say, okay, well not everyone's going to have that skill set in public speaking in the various different things that we teach. So we'll do that, but we'll also try to bring everyone up to the same level around sustainability and around kind of the SDGs and ESD, so many acronyms, butto try to bring everyone to a place where in later years of their degree, they have already had the opportunity to explore these skills and explore these types of assessments as well.

19:36

So students were saying to us, well, we get to second year and we haven't had a chance to do a poster yet. And actually it counts quite a lot in my second year. So could we do that in first year where we have a bit more support and where we can, for want of a better term, have space to fail? Because actually I mentioned, you know, we, we try to support quite a lot on the module. We make it very difficult to fail permanently. We want them to take on these challenges. We want them to, you know, perhaps not do as well in the first assessment, the project launch, but then recognise how they can improve that for the second.

20:05

Um, and so, yeah, it's tried to be a module that is responsive to what students wanted, but also is helping, as I say, to bridge that gap between where they were and where they are. So in practice, so from again, what I remembered, you know, it has to be intentional. So if we want to embed it as the inter-curriculum design, let's be intentional. Let's be explicit. Let's really truly embed it. So.

20:32

basically put it everywhere and throughout and kind of maybe also think how we can sort of scaffold it for the students, right. Thank you so much for great examples of assessment and learning activities and describing it all. It's brilliant. I think it's easy.

Just to jump in Jo, there's a point I wanted to make. I think that one of the things I haven't mentioned is Ikind of alluded to it right at end of that last comment about skills in later years and assessment types in later years. But I think there's also a way to think about ESD in the curriculum and how you

21:01

In the way that we talk about, let's say the Warwick Skills Award and how those skills have to work across the curriculum, then also vertically as well, that you're building on the skills each year, there is a space that I think for a discussion around, if you're building a curriculum for year one, year two, year three, how are you making sure that the sustainability skills are being built on and that students aren't just learning it in year one or not learning it in year one and then doing bits here and there?

21:30

How do you intentionally integrate it throughout an entire curriculum, which I realize is slightly beyond the PGA because obviously you're focusing on specific modules, but how can you, you're designing a smaller curriculum with two modules in it in my case, but that's a thought to try to give if your department's going through a curriculum review is how do we make sure that the skills that we're teaching in year one aren't just being repeated over and over again and that the students are actively building on.

21:56

Absolutely. Yes, I think, you know, on my PGA specifically, yes, we do this assessment with two modules only, because obviously how much can you assess? But the idea behind it is, yes, this exactly this program level design. And what you've just said, it's super, super helpful kind of in thinking of that. Right. That brings us to our final question, I think. What are we risking if we do not embed ESD in the curriculum design? We're risking many things, I think.

22:25

Graduates who aren't prepared for the challenges of the 21st century, we talk a lot about how do we create these future-ready graduates and, they have to this employability skill, they have to have information literacy. I think we have to work to ensure that the students that we'reteaching are understanding that, yes, they are going to leave here with a skill set, in my context, as a chemist, but actually...

22:48

You can't just go into any workplace andsociety at large and go, well, I'm a chemist and I have this skill set and that's it. Because we need them to think beyond themselves. We need them to think as using those different almost disciplinary lenses about how do we approach wicked problems? How do we begin to solve them? I think universities, there's a real risk as well if we're not teachingstudents and in a way that has embedded ESD into the different kind of modules and curricula that we're designing.

23:16

I think universities fundamentally would be failing at their civic responsibility as well. They have to be part of the communities that they sit within as well. think for many years that kind of town gown relationship has been quite fraught, but universities could perhaps show their value by being able to show the way that they're training graduates to have these ESD kind of skill sets and to have this kind of sustainability mindset, I suppose, as well. I think we talk a lot as well about

23:46

sustainable transformation and the fact that we as a society as a whole need to start thinking about how do we become more sustainable to make sure that we're, you know, as a species still here in a hundred years. And I think if we don't embed ESD in our curricula early on, there's a real risk that we're missing that opportunity to create students who can do that. I think if we look at HE from the point of view of employers, employers want students who have, you know, really specific

24:15

critical thinking competencies, that's always the one that seems to come up when you look at employability reports, particularly the ones we read through chemistry. ESD is a great way to get students to think critically. If you can embed that in your curriculum, it probably does it better than most other things because it makes you have to critically evaluate not only the world and the topic, but also yourself and your values in relation to that, which I think is for me the more transformational part of what we should be doing in HE anyway. It's also the right thing to do. I think that's something that we tend to not say that.

24:45

because we're in a marketized system which we won't go into, but it's the right thing to do. We should teach people how to look after the planet. We should teach people to think critically. We should teach people to be the best they can be. Absolutely. It's to be more. And that comes from my own experience in the past teaching students embeddingESD in my different sort of curricula in the past. Yes, they are.

25:08

generally interested in. Like you said, this interest grows not only from the students, but also from the parents and from mature students. People are generally moremore interested in me too, more explicitly and maybe more strongly. Thank you. This has been wonderful, Tom. Thank you so much. And I really, really hope that, you know, you're going to have new experiences at Elon soon. And hopefully when you're back, you can share those with us as well. And we can continue this conversation. That would be wonderful. And for today, thank you so much.

25:37

Thanks Jo, thanks so much, have a lovely day.